t3t4 vs t3s60

i;ve been looking and researching all over forum for what to get my 98 1.8 t as in terms of turbo upgrade. i've decided on either the t3 by Garrett or the t3s60 by Turbonetics. since i dont have enough for the exhausht manifold yet since i just got a godspeed intercooler, which turbo would be better for stock internals until i can get enough money to upgrade the size of my piping as well as going for the straight piping? after installing one of the two turbos and reflashing the ecu with a chip upgrade, how many horses can i expect?

I can't speak for the T3/T4 as I have no experice working with it, but on a friend's car a few years back we used a T3 super 60 and that turbo was an animal.  Granted the car (non-Audi) was built, including the engine, but even on a lowered compression ratio, the turbo spooled extremely fast and the boost hit very hard.  I've never seen a straight-up comparison of that turbo vs a T3/T4 before, so I can't speak as to which one would be better on a 1.8T - my main point in posting was to give you an idea of the characteristics of the T3s60 from my past experience.  It's a wicked little turbo and dealt out the power in a big way.

quote:

ORIGINAL: a4_shift
since i dont have enough for the exhausht manifold yet since i just got a godspeed intercooler, neither of those two turbos bolt up to the stock exhaust manifold

 after installing one of the two turbos and reflashing the ecu with a chip upgrade, i dont know of a chip to run either turbo. youre looking at standalones

the t3s60 is around 900 new, whereas a 50 trim can be found under 700 new. The t3s60 will spool a little before 4k whereas a 50 trim will be fully spooled a little bit after 4k, but the 50 trim will make a bit more power. Personally i'd go with the 50 trim. either turbo can be run on stock internals but you will NEED an exhaust manifold and dp. the rest of the exhaust you can cheap out on if you have to by removing mufflers and putting in straight pipes. and you will also need tuning and injectors. and look into a clutch down the road if you want to launch it at all. with highway pulls the clutch should be safe tho. and the t360 will be ~325whp the 50 trim can see upwards of 350whp, with full supporting mods ~400whp

quote:

ORIGINAL: a4_shift
after installing one of the two turbos and reflashing the ecu with a chip upgrade, i dont know of a chip to run either turbo. youre looking at standalones

CTapp or Uni 630cc file, both are are close to what you'd get from sem, at a fraction of the price. tuning has come a long way since those Mika days

i'm already set on getting the 50 trim, sorry to thread jack, but I'm sure this question might be helpful to you too. what kind of mpg do people get with the 50 trim, or most big turbos in general? The answer won't stop me from getting a t3/t4, but it's good to know.

sorry not really good with cars but am learning. so your saying either turbos can be run on stock internals but i still will need an exaust manifold but i can do the piping later on rite? i am leaning towards the t3 5o trim because it has great potential and after i will get the money for piping and intake. also what is dp? also i was reading and it siad i wil need an new diverter valve and boost gauge too rite?

nevermind dp is downpipe, lol wasnt thinking. also mine is a 5v and all the manifolds i can find are the 20 valve. where do you think i can find the exaust manifold for the 5 valve. 

quote:

ORIGINAL: chaos92287

the t3s60 is around 900 new, whereas a 50 trim can be found under 700 new. Both are $625.
The t3s60 will spool a little before 4k 3k
whereas a 50 trim will be fully spooled a little bit after 4k, On a .63, pre 4k on a .48
but the 50 trim will make a lots more power. Personally i'd go with the 50 trim. either turbo can be run on stock internals but you will NEED an exhaust manifold and dp. the rest of the exhaust you can cheap out on if you have to by removing mufflers and putting in straight pipes. and you will also need tuning and injectors. and look into a clutch down the road if you want to launch it at all. with highway pulls the clutch should be safe tho. and the t360 will be ~300whp the 50 trim can see upwards of 350whp, with full supporting mods ~400whp

 
fixed

Cincy.. let me get this right.

t3s60 will start spooling before 3k rpms.
50 trim .63 will be fully spooled a little after 4k.. so it'll start before 3k? just like the t3s60?
50 trim .48 will be fully spooled before 4k.. there for start spooling at about 2k rpms?

i just want to clarify, i want something that will spool quickly, but with some lag so it's good for daily street driving. the t3/t4 .48 seems like a winner imo.

The t3s60 will be at 20psi right around 3k
the 50trim .48 will start making boost around 3k and full boost before 4k
the 50trim .63 add 400rpms.

ive been lookin into a BT and bascially a t3s50 would be the best turbo upgrade right? i was talking about what turbo i want to start serioulsy looking into with my friends the other day and this type of turbo actually came up but im not too good with turbos. anyway, if money is not an issue would this turbo be a good choice, or if i have the funds should i go bigger then that??

The t3s60 would fit between the gt28r and gt28rs in power and spools up like the RS.  It you think that is enough power, than thats your turbo, if you want more power than that, get the .48 50trim.

quote:

ORIGINAL: a4_shift

nevermind dp is downpipe, lol wasnt thinking. also mine is a 5v and all the manifolds i can find are the 20 valve. where do you think i can find the exaust manifold for the 5 valve. 

you have a 20 valve. its 5 valves per cylinder. if you had a 5 valve 75% of your cylinders would even have an exhaust valve lol

here's a link for an atp knockoff- http://eurocustoms.net/oscommerce/catalog/product_info.php?cPath=21_26_30&products_id=89

same thing as atp only cheaper


and you will also need a new intake, maf, injectors, dp, tune, fuel pump, dv/bov, mbc, and fmic.

you might want to continue researching before doing such a swap based on your knowledge of your car, no offense or anything, and not to discourage future plans, but i see your at least trying to learn by coming here. gl.
 
http://books.google.com/images/cleardot.gif
 
sry not enought time to creat a real pic! gtg to class!

quote:

ORIGINAL: cincyTTthe t360 will be ~300whp

so around 270 or so awhp? or did you mean awhp?

i've heard of vw guys making 270whp on the t3s60, but that was with older revo software.

thanks cincy.

You can make 270-280awhp on basically a stock engine and boost.  WIth some w/m or race gas you should be able to reach the 300awhp mark.  People with fwd can make 300fwhp on pump and boost alone.  People with a AEB should start seeing more gains over the ATW/AWM when the power starts increasing.  This is a great streat turbo for anyone looking for a mild upgrade for a reasonable cost.  It has little lag and safe for stock engines.  A gt28rs would make more power when pushed, but thats why gt turbos are over $1k. 

a4_shift, dont mean to discourage you, but I dont think this is a job for you yet.. I mean your valve question shows it.  Just start out on something small, like exhaust or even a mbc and do lots of research

its all good yea im trying to learn, and i got some money saved up close to 4 k but i am gonna ask for a spot/loan from my pops and i would rather upgrade big now instead of little by little which will cost more at the end. and im takin my first auto class next quarter. lol. and of course i am having someone do it for me, me and my uncle just installed my godspeed intercooler and that pretty much all the hands on work i have dont thus far, besides the spark plugs oil changes and all that bullshit. i just wanted info on all the parts i needed in order for my engine to not blow up. =/

oh yea thanks for the knock off exhaust manifold i was ready to buy from atp for close to 350 and 400 for shipping and handling! thanx for saving me some money! anyone live in bay? i would to learn from audi lovers all my friends are into evos and jdm imports. 

no prob. and if you've done the fmic install, you can do the BT install. you just gotta remove a couple more parts, but its all basic bolt on stuff.