propane conversions
Zombie Defense Force
Joined: Mar 2007
Posts: 4,851
From: N/A
RE: propane conversions
ORIGINAL: NYankee
lets also not forget the logistical part of this, as is where the hell you gonna fill it up
I belive all propane sellers in our state are requeierd to fill only cierten bottles with very specific safty devices. if you were interested in a project like this, natural gas would be the way to go, cuz it more availible, you can buy a kit to tap into your house line, and it is around the same price
lets also not forget the logistical part of this, as is where the hell you gonna fill it up
I belive all propane sellers in our state are requeierd to fill only cierten bottles with very specific safty devices. if you were interested in a project like this, natural gas would be the way to go, cuz it more availible, you can buy a kit to tap into your house line, and it is around the same price
http://afdcmap2.nrel.gov/locator/FindPane.asp
1st Gear
Joined: Apr 2007
Posts: 77
From:
RE: propane conversions
oh wow i didnt even realize that. ok ya got me there, but I only have 1 that is still pretty out of the way according to the map. hmmm makes me think of doin a E85, no wait, they are all in denver, man this sux, i bet NY and the east coast got tons of them. damn hippies here are slowin down (or just smokin too much to care).
1st Gear
Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 216
From:
RE: propane conversions
ummm....I'm gonna second the "why the F would you wanna run your car on propane" comment....sorry. hardly any benefit. at all. and a giant pain in the a$$....if you got a diesel you could set up some crazy propane injection (like NOS) and burn the wheels off the thing. but I've seen and worked with vehicles working on LNG and propane, and its just such a pain. everything needs to be air tight, and contrary to popular believe, filling them is indeed a pain.
Thread Starter
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1st Gear
Joined: Feb 2007
Posts: 20
RE: propane conversions
Ok, apparently this was the wrong forum to ask this question. For your information, many people in europe run their cars on propane. Audi actually manufactures their cars from factory with propane kits on them in germany. Go to google and search a company called Prins LPG. They make a propane injected kit for cars. You don't need to freeze propane to keep it in a liquid state. It naturally is cold. Why do you think you need a vaporizer (something you run your HOT antifreeze through to change propane from liquid to gas before it enters the carburator). I have a 1992 Accord that has been running on propane for 1.5 years already using the basic carburator set-up that i stole off a fork lift. Works great. Simply install the carburator in place of the airbox on the air intake and find the power to your fuel injectors. Wire to a switch in the cab and you can switch back and forth from gasoline and propane. That set-up cost me about $400 CDN with tank and installed it myself. Install took about 4 hrs. Fuel economy went from 27 MPG to 23MPG on propane compared to gasoline, but propane costs $0.40/Liter for me versus $1.20/Liter for gasoline. Thats 1/3 the cost. Did a calculation when i first installed the kit and it was costing me 3.5 cents per kilometer to drive on propane compared to my parents jetta TDI which cost 4.5 cents. Now these newer propane kits are called sequentially injected propane systems with a second set of fuel injectors for the propane. Also comes with a full computer that controls the system and takes care of all the issues you might have like throwing out check engine lights and what not. These new kits are supposed to have no power losses with a 10-15% increase in fuel consumption compared to gasoline. These new kits run about $4500 installed and basing the fact that my A4 burns about 12 liters to 100 km's on average that means i'm saving about $8.80 per 100 km's on fuel costs factoring in the 15% increase in consumption. So that means in about 50,000 km's i would have this kit paid off. Thats about a years driving for me. Now the kit to buy alone, which i would do, is about $2300. Installation is not that bad and i would save the money and do it myself. That means i only have to drive about 26,000 km's to pay off the kit and start saving.
Zombie Defense Force
Joined: Mar 2007
Posts: 4,851
From: N/A
RE: propane conversions
Yeah, it totally is the wrong forum. Ask about upgrading a turbo or adding a boost gauge or installing suspension packages. This forum revolves around mostly tuner culture and the average do-it-yourself projects. Not about converting your engine to run on a fuel it was never designed to run on. You seem like you already have all the answers you need, so why even ask? And besides, had you used the awesome search button, you would have gotten your answer a whole lot sooner.
Thread Starter
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1st Gear
Joined: Feb 2007
Posts: 20
RE: propane conversions
hmmm....... tried this "awesome" search button and was directed to threads on tie rod help, anyone running nitrous (which our engines weren't designed to run on either!!), and stereo install work. Definitely did not answer my question. I know how the propane systems work and know that it does work, wasn't the question. I asked if anyone here has done it. Look at all the fedex, ups, and most taxi cabs. They all run on propane because its a very effective way of cutting fuel costs and all those engines are the same as the gasoline ones. No difference there. Everyone here talks about running increased boost or nitrous or changing fuel ratios for more power and better performance. All these mods are way harder on the engine than running on propane. Think of it this way,you do a turbo install and screw up your fuel ratios and run the car too lean. BOOM there goes your engine. Run a car too lean on propane and it just runs out of power.
1st Gear
Joined: Nov 2006
Posts: 359
From: long island, ny
RE: propane conversions
so you are going to risk blowing up, to save enough money to have it paid off in 50k? That's kinda pricey to save so little. I mean, I guess every little bit helps, but thats a tiny bit if its going to take that long. But hell, I don't know **** about propane cars.
Zombie Defense Force
Joined: Mar 2007
Posts: 4,851
From: N/A
RE: propane conversions
ORIGINAL: M3S2k
hmmm....... tried this "awesome" search button and was directed to threads on tie rod help, anyone running nitrous (which our engines weren't designed to run on either!!), and stereo install work. Definitely did not answer my question. I know how the propane systems work and know that it does work, wasn't the question. I asked if anyone here has done it. Look at all the fedex, ups, and most taxi cabs. They all run on propane because its a very effective way of cutting fuel costs and all those engines are the same as the gasoline ones. No difference there. Everyone here talks about running increased boost or nitrous or changing fuel ratios for more power and better performance. All these mods are way harder on the engine than running on propane. Think of it this way,you do a turbo install and screw up your fuel ratios and run the car too lean. BOOM there goes your engine. Run a car too lean on propane and it just runs out of power.
hmmm....... tried this "awesome" search button and was directed to threads on tie rod help, anyone running nitrous (which our engines weren't designed to run on either!!), and stereo install work. Definitely did not answer my question. I know how the propane systems work and know that it does work, wasn't the question. I asked if anyone here has done it. Look at all the fedex, ups, and most taxi cabs. They all run on propane because its a very effective way of cutting fuel costs and all those engines are the same as the gasoline ones. No difference there. Everyone here talks about running increased boost or nitrous or changing fuel ratios for more power and better performance. All these mods are way harder on the engine than running on propane. Think of it this way,you do a turbo install and screw up your fuel ratios and run the car too lean. BOOM there goes your engine. Run a car too lean on propane and it just runs out of power.
By searching, you would have found that no one has tried to do this before with an A4 on this forum. And as far as nitrous goes, if you're smart about it, you can run nitrous on any engine. You're right, though, no car was 'designed' to run on NO2. You have to upgrade it with the proper supporting mods first, then you can safely enhance your engine with a wet nitrous system.
Don't come here and make 11 posts and then assume you know everything about this forum. It's a wealth of information for what the majority of Audi tuners and do-it-yourselfers need. For extremely limited information that you seek, you should look to the companies that you wish to buy your conversion kit from.
And by the way, FedEx and such more often use CNG, not LP
1st Gear
Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 216
From:
RE: propane conversions
ORIGINAL: M3S2k
Ok, apparently this was the wrong forum to ask this question. For your information, many people in europe run their cars on propane. Audi actually manufactures their cars from factory with propane kits on them in germany. Go to google and search a company called Prins LPG. They make a propane injected kit for cars. You don't need to freeze propane to keep it in a liquid state. It naturally is cold. Why do you think you need a vaporizer (something you run your HOT antifreeze through to change propane from liquid to gas before it enters the carburator). I have a 1992 Accord that has been running on propane for 1.5 years already using the basic carburator set-up that i stole off a fork lift. Works great. Simply install the carburator in place of the airbox on the air intake and find the power to your fuel injectors. Wire to a switch in the cab and you can switch back and forth from gasoline and propane. That set-up cost me about $400 CDN with tank and installed it myself. Install took about 4 hrs. Fuel economy went from 27 MPG to 23MPG on propane compared to gasoline, but propane costs $0.40/Liter for me versus $1.20/Liter for gasoline. Thats 1/3 the cost. Did a calculation when i first installed the kit and it was costing me 3.5 cents per kilometer to drive on propane compared to my parents jetta TDI which cost 4.5 cents. Now these newer propane kits are called sequentially injected propane systems with a second set of fuel injectors for the propane. Also comes with a full computer that controls the system and takes care of all the issues you might have like throwing out check engine lights and what not. These new kits are supposed to have no power losses with a 10-15% increase in fuel consumption compared to gasoline. These new kits run about $4500 installed and basing the fact that my A4 burns about 12 liters to 100 km's on average that means i'm saving about $8.80 per 100 km's on fuel costs factoring in the 15% increase in consumption. So that means in about 50,000 km's i would have this kit paid off. Thats about a years driving for me. Now the kit to buy alone, which i would do, is about $2300. Installation is not that bad and i would save the money and do it myself. That means i only have to drive about 26,000 km's to pay off the kit and start saving.
Ok, apparently this was the wrong forum to ask this question. For your information, many people in europe run their cars on propane. Audi actually manufactures their cars from factory with propane kits on them in germany. Go to google and search a company called Prins LPG. They make a propane injected kit for cars. You don't need to freeze propane to keep it in a liquid state. It naturally is cold. Why do you think you need a vaporizer (something you run your HOT antifreeze through to change propane from liquid to gas before it enters the carburator). I have a 1992 Accord that has been running on propane for 1.5 years already using the basic carburator set-up that i stole off a fork lift. Works great. Simply install the carburator in place of the airbox on the air intake and find the power to your fuel injectors. Wire to a switch in the cab and you can switch back and forth from gasoline and propane. That set-up cost me about $400 CDN with tank and installed it myself. Install took about 4 hrs. Fuel economy went from 27 MPG to 23MPG on propane compared to gasoline, but propane costs $0.40/Liter for me versus $1.20/Liter for gasoline. Thats 1/3 the cost. Did a calculation when i first installed the kit and it was costing me 3.5 cents per kilometer to drive on propane compared to my parents jetta TDI which cost 4.5 cents. Now these newer propane kits are called sequentially injected propane systems with a second set of fuel injectors for the propane. Also comes with a full computer that controls the system and takes care of all the issues you might have like throwing out check engine lights and what not. These new kits are supposed to have no power losses with a 10-15% increase in fuel consumption compared to gasoline. These new kits run about $4500 installed and basing the fact that my A4 burns about 12 liters to 100 km's on average that means i'm saving about $8.80 per 100 km's on fuel costs factoring in the 15% increase in consumption. So that means in about 50,000 km's i would have this kit paid off. Thats about a years driving for me. Now the kit to buy alone, which i would do, is about $2300. Installation is not that bad and i would save the money and do it myself. That means i only have to drive about 26,000 km's to pay off the kit and start saving.
tangent. at any rate, how long does it take you to fill that propane honda? and also, where do you fill it? all of the propane filling stations that I know of are for grill tanks, and they measure how much they give you by weighing the tank before and after filling it. which needless to say you wouldn't be able to do with a car.
