Is it possible to change the cam adjuster without removing the timing belt?
#11
02-16-2010, 01:41 PM
Auditech,
I still don't see that this will work properly. When he pulls the cam sproket off the cam, he loses the relationship between the cam and the cam sprocket, which sets the cam timing to the crank. If he then removes the cam, replaces the tensioner then puts the cams back in place, even if he is really careful, how does he make sure that the cam to cam gear timing is correct and not just close enough? Normally, the cam bar would set the cam timing to the crank and then you put the belt on where ever it goes and tighten it down to lock in the timing. How does he do this without the cam tool? It doesn't take much for the cams to be off enough to feel.
Bob
I still don't see that this will work properly. When he pulls the cam sproket off the cam, he loses the relationship between the cam and the cam sprocket, which sets the cam timing to the crank. If he then removes the cam, replaces the tensioner then puts the cams back in place, even if he is really careful, how does he make sure that the cam to cam gear timing is correct and not just close enough? Normally, the cam bar would set the cam timing to the crank and then you put the belt on where ever it goes and tighten it down to lock in the timing. How does he do this without the cam tool? It doesn't take much for the cams to be off enough to feel.
Bob
Last edited by Site_Administrator; 02-16-2010 at 01:49 PM.
#12
02-16-2010, 02:13 PM
If you loosened the cam sprockets, then indeed you are fucked. Anyways, you can rent a set of tools from Blauparts for about $40 plus shipping. You get all the goodies, not only the cam lock bar.
I don't want to sound like an a-hole, but you need to do some homework before attacking a big repair job like this. Audis aren't the only cars with specialties tools. Yes you can open up a small block with a set to sockets, but when was the last time you opened up a late model DOHC head on a typical domestic vehicle? You still need alignment and specialty tools. Just think of it this way... it will last you longer now. Sometimes having fly bitches are better than run of the mill janes. If you treat them right, they treat you right.
Anyways, since you will be opening up everything again, replace the cam seals if you haven't done them already.
I don't want to sound like an a-hole, but you need to do some homework before attacking a big repair job like this. Audis aren't the only cars with specialties tools. Yes you can open up a small block with a set to sockets, but when was the last time you opened up a late model DOHC head on a typical domestic vehicle? You still need alignment and specialty tools. Just think of it this way... it will last you longer now. Sometimes having fly bitches are better than run of the mill janes. If you treat them right, they treat you right.
Anyways, since you will be opening up everything again, replace the cam seals if you haven't done them already.
#13
02-16-2010, 03:53 PM
If you loosened the cam sprockets, then indeed you are fucked. Anyways, you can rent a set of tools from Blauparts for about $40 plus shipping. You get all the goodies, not only the cam lock bar.
I don't want to sound like an a-hole, but you need to do some homework before attacking a big repair job like this. Audis aren't the only cars with specialties tools. Yes you can open up a small block with a set to sockets, but when was the last time you opened up a late model DOHC head on a typical domestic vehicle? You still need alignment and specialty tools. Just think of it this way... it will last you longer now. Sometimes having fly bitches are better than run of the mill janes. If you treat them right, they treat you right.
Anyways, since you will be opening up everything again, replace the cam seals if you haven't done them already.
I don't want to sound like an a-hole, but you need to do some homework before attacking a big repair job like this. Audis aren't the only cars with specialties tools. Yes you can open up a small block with a set to sockets, but when was the last time you opened up a late model DOHC head on a typical domestic vehicle? You still need alignment and specialty tools. Just think of it this way... it will last you longer now. Sometimes having fly bitches are better than run of the mill janes. If you treat them right, they treat you right.
Anyways, since you will be opening up everything again, replace the cam seals if you haven't done them already.
LOL....no I didn't loosen the Cam Sprocket. I took valve cover off and loosened camshaft caps and I had to take a **** so i went on here and this Bob guy has a point. Here is a video after I put everything back together this morning. I took it with my iphone. Hope it helps understand exactly what I'm talking about....
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m-0RKEktdVI
So... for the record and once and for all... is it truly possible to swap out the tensioner on this side without having to remove the belt or loosen the sproket???? I have the tensioner in my hands and it looks pretty good. I want to order the timing tools on ebay from el paso tools. **** blaukpunks... they are too expensive. I am still using Mobil one fully synthetic ATF and it shifts fine. You fools pay too much for Dexron 3 with another name and color.
Here is another angle of the noise...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kObl8ElobuY
Last edited by Site_Administrator; 02-16-2010 at 04:02 PM.
#14
02-19-2010, 02:03 AM
Well, I ordered the cam holding bar and crank lock pin. The do it yourself says 16 chain rollers and I think that's incorrect. I see 15 chain rollers would align the nothes in the back with the arrows on the caps. Doesn't make no sense. I am following my instinct here. I also noticed you said remove the sprocket and lay it over the radiator....then you switched your story and said if I remove the sprocket "I'm fucked".
So anyway...people if you learn anything from me...learn this....Do not listen to these kids on the forum that borrow their dad's tools and never bring them back. Take the ideas, but double check official manuals. If Bob didn't mention about the sprocket, I'd probably take a short cut out of laziness and fucked up my valves reading the Do it yourself link in this thread.
It ain't 16...it is 15 chain links. I can not verify for certain...but the marks dont line up at 16.
Can anybody confirm this so I can put this car back together?????
So anyway...people if you learn anything from me...learn this....Do not listen to these kids on the forum that borrow their dad's tools and never bring them back. Take the ideas, but double check official manuals. If Bob didn't mention about the sprocket, I'd probably take a short cut out of laziness and fucked up my valves reading the Do it yourself link in this thread.
It ain't 16...it is 15 chain links. I can not verify for certain...but the marks dont line up at 16.
Can anybody confirm this so I can put this car back together?????
#15
02-19-2010, 11:47 AM
When you are referring to "you" are you referring to me? I don't believe I said to lay the sprocket over the radiator(?) I did say if you remove the sprocket, then you are fucked, in a context where you don't have the cam lock bar. If you do, then you are okay.
As for the 16 chain links, refer to this diagram that I generated a couple of years back.
It is 16, not 15. I noticed on mine that my intake cam marking was actually on a valley, not on the tooth. But just count 16 including the chainlink right above the mark.
As for the 16 chain links, refer to this diagram that I generated a couple of years back.
It is 16, not 15. I noticed on mine that my intake cam marking was actually on a valley, not on the tooth. But just count 16 including the chainlink right above the mark.
#16
02-19-2010, 04:04 PM
When you are referring to "you" are you referring to me? I don't believe I said to lay the sprocket over the radiator(?) I did say if you remove the sprocket, then you are fucked, in a context where you don't have the cam lock bar. If you do, then you are okay.
As for the 16 chain links, refer to this diagram that I generated a couple of years back.
It is 16, not 15. I noticed on mine that my intake cam marking was actually on a valley, not on the tooth. But just count 16 including the chainlink right above the mark.
As for the 16 chain links, refer to this diagram that I generated a couple of years back.
It is 16, not 15. I noticed on mine that my intake cam marking was actually on a valley, not on the tooth. But just count 16 including the chainlink right above the mark.
Last edited by Site_Administrator; 02-19-2010 at 04:17 PM.
#17
02-19-2010, 11:52 PM
I've never had a problem getting the belt exactly where it was before, thats why i use white out on the belt and a spot on the valve cover to know exactly where it goes back. If you had the channel lock on the belt and the one pulley is unbolted, 99% chance there won't be enough tension on the other cam and crank to turn the engine. This was an advanced move on a V6 yes, perhaps i should have added you can use the cam bar at the end of the job to make sure everything is A OK. I assumed you knew what you were doing, i apologize for not explaining it better, that DIY was for a 1.8T
It should be 16 teeth on the tensioner, However if you had one tooth off the cam chain you would have misfire heaven, so you must have gotten it right. Strange that your repair manual says 15 teeth, first time i have seen that because all the cylinder heads for the 1.8T, 2.8, 2.7, and 4.2L are exactly the same as far as the tensioner goes.
As for the rattling, it can take up to 50 miles of driving before the chatter goes away, takes a little bit of breaking in. If it still chatters after that, then maybe you have an oil pressure problem starving the tensioner of oil. Pull the oil sender out of the oil cooler and insert a pressure gauge and see what you got.
It should be 16 teeth on the tensioner, However if you had one tooth off the cam chain you would have misfire heaven, so you must have gotten it right. Strange that your repair manual says 15 teeth, first time i have seen that because all the cylinder heads for the 1.8T, 2.8, 2.7, and 4.2L are exactly the same as far as the tensioner goes.
As for the rattling, it can take up to 50 miles of driving before the chatter goes away, takes a little bit of breaking in. If it still chatters after that, then maybe you have an oil pressure problem starving the tensioner of oil. Pull the oil sender out of the oil cooler and insert a pressure gauge and see what you got.
Last edited by auditech79; 02-19-2010 at 11:56 PM.
#18
02-20-2010, 05:43 AM
It has gotten a little quieter after driving it 18 miles today. You can barely hear it now. But I am reving it on purpose. If you don't tell anyone about it, they won't even notice. But I notice it and it's probably been doing that since I bought it. But after a while we tend to notice every imperfection of our cars. The tensioners are definately working...cause you can obviously hear them adjusting loudly.
The oil pressure was my next move. But I will save that project for another day. I doubt the oil pressure is bad. Maybe I'll change the oil to 10W-50 or add lucas oil treatment to see if it helps.
By the way, I am selling my brand new Camshaft holding bar (T40005), crankshaft tool 3242, ZF-5HP24A Transmission repair manual -Complete overhaul illustration manual. Ebahn repair DVD's covers every Audi, A4,A6,A8 and other Audis all years.... For $350 bucks bonanza special. I also have the little tool to tension the cam tentioners, and the tool for the ecentric tensioner. For sale. No more ******* around with this car. I threw away $650 bucks these past three days for nothing. same results. This is it. I am driving this car untill it dies. Everything is new on this car. Timing belt, water pump, 4 new tires, new tranny, new rotors, new shocks and struts, new front wheel bearings, new fuel pump, new transmission control module, New headliner, fixed the warped dash folding up on the sides, new window regulators, home made motor and tranny mounts with 3m window sealer... runs real ****** solid... New AC compressor....what the **** man....No more more being a victim to this stupid car. I will trade for a Pointiac trans AM, Camaro or Mustang anyday.
The oil pressure was my next move. But I will save that project for another day. I doubt the oil pressure is bad. Maybe I'll change the oil to 10W-50 or add lucas oil treatment to see if it helps.
By the way, I am selling my brand new Camshaft holding bar (T40005), crankshaft tool 3242, ZF-5HP24A Transmission repair manual -Complete overhaul illustration manual. Ebahn repair DVD's covers every Audi, A4,A6,A8 and other Audis all years.... For $350 bucks bonanza special. I also have the little tool to tension the cam tentioners, and the tool for the ecentric tensioner. For sale. No more ******* around with this car. I threw away $650 bucks these past three days for nothing. same results. This is it. I am driving this car untill it dies. Everything is new on this car. Timing belt, water pump, 4 new tires, new tranny, new rotors, new shocks and struts, new front wheel bearings, new fuel pump, new transmission control module, New headliner, fixed the warped dash folding up on the sides, new window regulators, home made motor and tranny mounts with 3m window sealer... runs real ****** solid... New AC compressor....what the **** man....No more more being a victim to this stupid car. I will trade for a Pointiac trans AM, Camaro or Mustang anyday.
#20
03-28-2010, 07:35 PM
I just got back from New York. I drove my audi from Tampa to New York and Philly and Atlantic City and it ran like a charm. Still makes the chain rattle sound all the time....but the car was very reliable and stable. I put more than 3000 miles in a month... Goes to show that the ATF Fluid from the factory is bullshit. Mobile 1 synthetic ATF for audi is fine. even dextron 3 is fine. Been driving like crazy for about a year, and the rebuild job was easy and successful and cheap! only $600 bucks. Changed the filter not too long ago just to see the pan and magnets....looks really clean and bright red still. Damn I'm good! The chain rattle though has me stressing still. I even poured in a Lucas synthetic oil treatment to thicken the royal purple oil change(synthetic also)... and the thicker oils dont make a difrence to the rattle sounds in the video.