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turbo worth it?

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  #11  
Old 11-30-2012, 04:55 PM
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It's not a matter of bolting the parts together that's the biggest issue, it's in he fabrication and especially in the tuning. Depending on the pile of parts you use, you might be able to run the car on a tune for a different setup along with piggyback controllers like an Apexi S-AFC or a GReddy Rebic-III AIC. If not, you'll need a dyno, provisions for EGT probes, wideband O2 sensors, a standalone ECU or tunable software setup, and many, many hours of run time to literally write your own tune. Or you can pay for probably 30 hours of dyno time plus a tuning technician's time to create a custom file for the car. Building a custom setup of that extent is a far cry from setting up a domestic V8. And you also need to factor in boost - how much are you looking to run? Any amount of boost worth spending this kind of time and money on will require a built bottom end, big fueling system, custom exhaust manifolds, etc etc etc ad infinitum.

This is why there's really no logic to building this type of system for the 2.8. You could spend more money on parts and bullshit than it would cost to buy a 350hp stage 2 S4, and not even make as much power. Plus the S4 comes with more of the goodies like a nicer set of seats, better suspension, bigger brakes, 6mt, factory HIDs, color-matched rocker panels, and a host of nice interior features.
 
  #12  
Old 11-30-2012, 04:57 PM
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Being a 97, it's a 12v engine. Only supercharger setup out there was Motodyne and they had a **** reputation for their tune and incomplete kits. The unfortunate truth is that for modding an Audi, you bought pretty much the most untunable model out there. Sorry.
 
  #13  
Old 12-02-2012, 08:38 AM
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I'd sell it and look for a 4 cylinder OR a S4. With the 4 cylinder you can knock down 220awhp with a bolt on turbo setup and a tune. That is plenty fast for a daily which should still get close to 30 mpg highway and can get you to work in the winter time.

Personally I would look for a S4 though as they have so much more potential.

imthedevil- I don't get your assertation on paying for 30 plus hours of dyno time and paying for a technician at all. Most standalone setups have or will provide a base map on your setup which will get you to the dyno for the tune. 90% of the time a good tuner will have you very close to max after 3 pulls. 3 hours is typical.
 
  #14  
Old 12-02-2012, 09:45 AM
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For a custom set up Devil is saying you need tuning. No one makes base files for custom stuff is what he's getting at. Theres base maps for things that have been done like say a holeset on an AEB. A 12v turbo with horrible compression, bad flow, ect.. will need a tune, and some dyno time unless the builder can also tune. Maybe not countless hours or the tuner is probaly not the best. I agree within 3 pulls or so he should have that **** pretty close.
 
  #15  
Old 12-02-2012, 11:02 AM
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I actually meant that most setups you either get a basemap or the manufacturer will provide a basemap. My last car was 1986 Toyota Corolla GTS and I turbo'd it. There is no tuning package for it and the stock ECU uses messed up AFM that its voltage starts at 9v and drops to 0v when wide open. The only decent option that does not cost an arm and a leg is MegaSquirt. When you use MS it has a program that you put in your motor specs and it spits out a basemap for you start with. All standalones that I know off have this feature or the manufacture will get you one to start with no matter your setup.

Tuning any setup is pretty much the same. You simply need to understand what you are trying to achieve. The biggest mistake that most make is with AFR's and timing which is where you make hp. Most assume that pushing timing till you knock and then back it off a degree will max out hp. Sometimes it does and sometimes it does not. With AFR I have seen people assume that with lower AFR the better. The OEM use low AFR like 10.0:1 or even in the 9.5:1 range to lower inlet temps by using the fuel to cool the intake especially when the setup gets hot. Using extremely RICH combinations can wash the oil off the cylinder walls and kill rings and compression.

I am agreeing that turbo'n the 2.8 is a waste just don't agree that tuning is the major bump to overcome. The fab custom fab work and cost per hp is the issues that make it pointless in my opinion.
 
  #16  
Old 12-02-2012, 11:57 AM
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The point I'm getting at with tuning is that I'm talking about real, daily driving, complete-package tuning, not just dialing it in for max power. If you have an existing ECU map that's being modified to extract or maximize power based on hardware mods, then yes, a handful of pulls on the dyno from a tuner experienced on that particular platform should do it. But when you start with a base map that does nothing but idle the car, there's a lot more to do. There's more software in a universal TV remote than there is in an 86 Corolla, so that's not really a fair comparison. I don't see a tuner making three pulls and dialing in not only safe max power, but partial-load timing under boost, cold and hot start mixtures, safety map for bad gas/knock sensor trigger/injector sputter/etc, hot-engine idle, etc , all the while passing emissions and running smoothly (and being OBD-2 compliant). That's a whole different animal. That's where the long dyno times come in. Making a car run smoothly in ALL parameters is tuning.
 
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